Transcript in Last Zane Seipler Wrongful Termination Court Hearing – Part 7

December 24th, McHenry County Blog ran the first part of the December 15, 2010, transcript of a Rockford hearing before Magistrate P. Michael Mahoney.

December 25th, the second part was published with the third installment published Sunday. Part 4 went up Monday, Part 5 Tuesday and Part 6 Wednesday.

This is Part 7.

As we ended yesterday’s portion of the transcript, Judge Mahoney was asking, “Well, what else is there?”

MR. HORWITZ: There’s a Monell theory.


MR. HORWITZ: There’s code of silence. There’s retaliation. For example, there are seven officers, Judge, who have come forward to testify, five in deposition, that there’s a code of silence at the department. There’s retaliation for coming forward. If you exercise your First Amendment — if you speak out against the department — five cops have testified.

These are guys that are working at the department, except for one.


MR. HORWITZ: I can give you their names if you want, but you got from 18 years on the department to less than a year. We have two officers who have not yet testified who I’ve disclosed to defense counsel are coming forward, as well, to say exactly the same things, one who is actually willing to be a 26(a)(2)(b) witness as to racial profiling, how these tickets are generated, the training the officers receive, and whatnot.

His name is Timothy Madison.

THE COURT: Is that the 26(a)(2) witness you talk about sometimes?

MR. HORWITZ: Yes. The need for him recently came forward based upon the 140 tickets.

THE COURT: What’s your 26(a)(2) witness going to say?

MR. HORWITZ: He will say — he will describe

  • how it is that racial profiling
  • how it is that the officers were trained at the department
  • how it is that Bruketta was trained at the department.


MR. HORWITZ: How it is that tickets are generated.


MR. HORWITZ: And how it is officers establish —

THE COURT: How is that opinion testimony so far?

MR. HORWITZ: Judge, if it isn’t 26(a)(2)(b) testimony, you ought to rule on that.

THE COURT: No. I’m just asking how it was. All you’ve done is tell me I saw this, I saw this, I saw this. How is that 26(a)(2)?

MR. HORWITZ: The reason why I believe it’s 26(a)(2) testimony is because the jury may not understand the training that occurred, how you can take all the training and match it with the correct way to —

THE COURT: All right. So, there comes a point in time where he’s going to offer opinions.

MR. HORWITZ: Yeah. Like you said to counsel, you know, what happens, that sort of thing.

THE COURT: Now, counsel, tell me again. What do you want to do besides what we’ve talked about so I can get this case to trial? What has to be done in your opinion?

MR. HORWITZ: All right. Going on, Dr. Meyer is a doctor that the defendants indicated they would facilitate in setting up his deposition. His deposition needs to be completed. Dr. Meyer.

MR. SOTOS: He testified, as well, but that one wasn’t finished, either.

THE COURT: Well, it was on May 24th, 2010. He testified for four hours.

MR. SOTOS: Right. On May 24th, Judge.

THE COURT: How many more hours do you need?

MR. HORWITZ: I probably need about an hour and a half.

THE COURT: What do you think?

MR. SOTOS: Honestly what I think, Judge, is I do not understand why there’s never been any need for him to explain why you would take somebody’s deposition in May, go through several different discovery closing deadlines that are coming, and then say six months later, “I want to finish his dep.” I mean, that’s not how — this case has been conducted in two separate discovery periods.

THE COURT: All right. Slow down. Slow down.

MR. SOTOS: You’re right.

THE COURT: All right. Now, number one, you still have the right to do any discovery that you want. Number two, things have popped up in this case. That’s why I’ve tried to talk to you before. Who is Dr. Meyer and in your opinion how does he fit into this case?

MR. SOTOS: Dr. Meyer is a doctor who examined plaintiff after he was in a shooting incident.

THE COURT: Psychologist?

MR. SOTOS: He shot somebody, and then he was —

THE COURT: Ph.D. doctor or medical?


THE COURT: Ph.D. doctor.

MR. SOTOS: Psychologist.

THE COURT: All right. So, did he counsel him or just examine him on behalf of the department?

MR. SOTOS: He examined him, I believe, first on behalf of the department and concluded that he shouldn’t be on the SWAT team because of the stress, things of that nature. I think that was primarily what he did. He said that because of what he was involved in —

THE COURT: All right. Why wasn’t four hours enough with this guy? Why aren’t you done?

MR. HORWITZ: Because the defendants took his deposition for about three and a half hours, and I was entitled — I was then — considering the four-hour time period you set and considering the four hours he had available for himself scheduling wise, I was only —

THE COURT: So, you only had 30 minutes with this guy?

MR. HORWITZ: Maybe half an — maybe 45 minutes, Judge. I don’t want to say on the record as an officer of the court exactly.

THE COURT: Does that sound right?

MR. SOTOS: I wasn’t there. I don’t remember. I just don’t know why it never came up in a half a year.

MR. HORWITZ: Judge, if you want me to respond to that, his associate —


MR. HORWITZ: His associate said, “I will give you the dates for Dr. Meyer’s deposition.” The reason why —

THE COURT: Is Dr. Meyer under their control?

MR. HORWITZ: The reason why he is under their control is he considers himself somebody that works for the department. He’s received —


MR. HORWITZ: I don’t know about still. I’m telling you the conversation between his associate and me. First of all, he is a friend of Sheriff —

THE COURT: How much time do you want with Dr. Meyer?

MR. HORWITZ: Hour and a half.

THE COURT: I’ll give you an hour. What else do you need?

MR. HORWITZ: Do I need to say more next time?


MR. HORWITZ: All right.

More tomorrow.


Transcript in Last Zane Seipler Wrongful Termination Court Hearing – Part 7 — 11 Comments

  1. Obviously it would seem a key part of pushing these rambling conspiracy theories would to be attack any psychologist that has interviewed this Siepler guy early and often.

  2. A quick internet search on Dr. Robert Meyer:
    Ph. D.
    Licensed Clinical Psychologist
    Fellow of the American College of Forensic Psychology
    Approved by the State of Illinois Sex Offender Board
    Apparentley has been qualified as an expert witness many times

    Has been testifying in multiple Illinois counties, including McHenry, Winnebago, DeKalb and Boone among others since 1983

    Must be some good reason the conspiracy theory couple is going on the proactive attack on this guy all of a sudden…

  3. You forgot to mention that the good doctor also makes large donations to Nygren’s politial fund, and his son has been hired to defend Nygren in some of the many law suits currently filed against him.

    He is a PHD not an MD. There is a huge difference. Hire a real Psychiatrist. At least that would mean something. Oh yeah. It is because his opinion differs from those of the real doctors who also interviewed this Siepler guy early and often.

    Your blind obedience makes me wonder what you are getting out of this. Anyone with a brain cell knows there are two sides to a story. You seem incapable of even considering that this group are anything other than saints who are being unfairly abused by numerous authorities. That makes anything you say biased and therefore, worthless.

    What is your justification on why Nygren refused to give Schlenkert his court ordered back pay?

  4. Don’t know much about the Schlenkert case…Was he they guy who claimed he had panic attacks whenever he sat in a squad car? Don’t I remember something about a Psychologist helping him “get better”?

    Also confused why the Anti Sheriff crowd is so dismissive of Professional Psychologists and preferring a Psychiatrist…isn’t the main difference that Psychiatrists lean towards medication as cures? You guys aren’t suggesting that Zane should have seen someone for some Psychiatric drugs instead of just some counseling sessions with a Psychologist, are you?

  5. AreYou, was Zane diagnosed with some mental problem we don’t know about or was that what the county was trying to say to discredit him also. Milliman had brain cancer 8 years ago, so of course they will try to make it a mental issue. Maybe they should use an independent mutually agreed upon doctor to examine Milliman. Not a doctor that gives Nygren donations and has done “exams” on deputies Nygren doesn’t like previously. Doctors opinions can be bought.

  6. Don’t know yet about any diagnosis, walrushunter. We will have to wait until the testimony is made public. Doesn’t take a rocket scientist though to see that the anti Nygren crowd is launching a pretty aggressive attack campaign on the witness already…it has got to be for a reason.

  7. They are sending Milliman to doc Meyer in a couple weeks. There could be only one reason, to discredit him buy saying he is nuts. No sense looking into the alleged activities he must be goofy. They tried the same thing with Zane. Instead they had to go back through hundreds of trafffic stops to find a reason to fire him.

  8. So you are saying that a psychologist who pays into Nygren’s campaing fund and has a son who works for Nygren is unbiased? And you believe that hiding these facts is acceptable?

    If you think that the only difference between a psychologist and an MD is treating with medication, you had better go back to Biology 101. It is that kind of mentality that allows you to blindly follow all you are told like a puppy desperate for attention.

    No Schlenkert did not have panic attacks when he sat in his squad. That was a lie told by the MCSD. He had gone through very serious personal tragedy and did have a panic attack. This was an event that could happen to anyone and would likely cause the same result. It had nothing to do with work, and was a one time event. It was used as an excuse to remove him. It took 8 different evaluations to find a doc who sided with Nygren. 7 of them sided with Schlenkert, but their opinions were not accepted by MCSD. The court felt differently, but Nygren continued to run up the bill for court fees fighting it anyway. Very similar to what he is doing to Seipler and Milliman. He cannot admit when he is wrong, and he makes the tax payers flip the bill for his obstinacy.

  9. Son who works for Nygren? Where are you coming up with that one? Isn’t he a lawyer for a firm who is suing Nygren in Federal court in the Pavlin lawsuit?

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